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$2.20, satelite tournament on the bubble

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$2.20, satelite tournament on the bubble - Wed Sep 17, 2014, 06:00 AM
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Webbo62's Avatar
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Interested in opinions on this one, I know I came out good at the end but interested to know if this is how I should have played the hand or should I have played at all from UTG.

Final table, 7 players left and 5 get tournament tickets 6th gets cash 7th gets nothing. Due to bubble play had been extremely tight and villain 2 had been using his big stack to shove over the top a few times stealing blinds and bets.


 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 06:12 AM
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rkleefstra's Avatar
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(not seen the hand play out yet)

I'm thinking two things:
1) Is QKo a good enough hand to open in this spot? Play has been extremely tight so if you get raised here by any of the others (not Villain2), QKo will be behind a lot of the times and I dont think you can call.
If villain2 shoves, are you willing to call with "just" KQo?

2) If I play this hand, I would be shoving it, and not make a 2 x raise.



(seen the hand)
Guess you were willing to call a shove...
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 06:53 AM
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Was willing to call a shove by villain 2 yes, but as I say play was tight and I knew any raise from elsewhere on the table most likely had me beat so could easily have folded hence not playing the shove to start.

That was my thinking but also the reason I posted to get some constructive advice, I'm fairly sure if I had shoved initially I would have had no callers, villain_2 seemed to be shoving over the top of bets but had not seen him call a shove.

So a lot of my decision to play it was based on the way the table had been playing, but I'm still learning so appreciate your input.
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Webbo62 View Post
That was my thinking but also the reason I posted to get some constructive advice, I'm fairly sure if I had shoved initially I would have had no callers, villain_2 seemed to be shoving over the top of bets but had not seen him call a shove.
I see nothing wrong with nobody calling my shove. I've no problem with adding 625 to our stack.
But althought you are technically not in " shove or fold" mode, you are very close to it, and with a bigstack bully thats shoving to 2 x bets... I think shove or fold is best here.
Plus paying 600 and folding to shoves from other players is not something you can do very often with your stack. In fact this would be the only time. After that you are shortstack going into the blinds.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Webbo62 View Post
So a lot of my decision to play it was based on the way the table had been playing, but I'm still learning so appreciate your input.

The play at the table should very much decide how you play !

What buyin did this sat have? How many runners? Whats the ticket worth? What cash does 6th place get?
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 08:19 AM
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buy in was $2.20
6th place was $9
ticket was worth $11

Not big stakes but I am no where near the level of ability to play big stakes.

I had 3rd biggest stack when tournament finished with last 5
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 08:46 AM
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Posts: 2,328

Gonna sell the ticket for T$ or playing the tourney?
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 08:55 AM
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had to sell the ticket as when I checked the time of the event if I did well I would have had to leave making it pointless joining it.
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 09:47 AM
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Since: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,328
I always sell my sat-tickets. I don't like MTT's very much. Very timeconsuming with very low ROI (unless...)
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 11:11 AM
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Hey all!

I just put this into an ICM calculator (what we need to use to determine our ranges for FT's, especially satty FT's) and from it, this is a clear fold.

Due to my chip stack (13BB), I need to be open-shoving or folding and from the ICM calc, the ONLY hands that I should be shoving here are KK and AA. Even QQ is a fold due to the big stack in the SB and the number of opps behind us.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 11:28 AM
(#10)
rkleefstra's Avatar
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Good one, JWK.
Tried it myself. I must be doing something wrong because i get a push of 25%. KQo is well within that range...

Question JWK, are you doing that during play when you are in a situation like this?
For me it would take too much time to fill all the data
 
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Wed Sep 17, 2014, 11:34 AM
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No. You can't use them during play (prohibited software while the client is running). I run them afterwards for review whenever I get into spots like this.

Once you run thru a couple hundred situations, you start to get more and more of a feel for what ranges you'll get for shoving and calling... so you will have an idea for the next time. Then, when the game's over, you can then go review the new situations.

The calculator that I'm using is ICMIZER.

John (JWK24)


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Thu Sep 18, 2014, 08:04 AM
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my concern would be if I am folding this my stack would certainly have disappeared before I found AA or KK and probably before I found a better hand to run with. Meanwhile the big stack would have just continued to sweep up the blinds.

I know what you are saying with going UTG, I really was hoping to isolate the big stack as he had shoved over the top of 4 of the last 5 people to bet all resulting in him making a steal and adding about 5 k to his stack, I was sure he was shoving with a very wide range and felt this was my best chance to try and isolate him, I wasn't 100% sure of what hands others had so didn't really want to lead with a shove on a KQo.

I am still a novice though and really appreciate the advice.

I am not familiar with using ICM so don't know anything about them, guess that's something else I should learn.
 
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Thu Sep 18, 2014, 10:04 AM
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The key point with ICM is that if you're the first one into the pot, you can shove wider than normal... BUT... if someone else is already in the pot, you can only call if you have a better hand than normal.

John (JWK24)


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6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Thu Sep 18, 2014, 10:22 AM
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Villain 2 in this instance was shoving over the top of bets with a very wide range and relying on the fact it was near the bubble for people to fold
 
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Thu Sep 18, 2014, 10:27 AM
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That's taken into account in the ICM calculations, as a big stack should be shoving a much wider range to abuse the bubble.

John (JWK24)


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6 Time Bracelet Winner


 

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