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two strange hands in a tournament

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two strange hands in a tournament - Mon Sep 22, 2014, 05:46 AM
(#1)
Webbo62's Avatar
Since: Jul 2014
Posts: 357
BronzeStar
ok going to show two consecutive hands here.

First Hand

I'm holding A4o in the big blind, SB raises to 150 so I call to see a flop I have about 3x the stacks of the rest of the table SB has a stack 11x the rest and over 3x mine.

Flop came 567 giving me the open ended straight.
SB makes a pot size bet so I call.

Turn came the jack of clubs making a rainbow board I didn't have villain_8 down as having the straight even though he pushed all in, felt it was a massive overbet to push me off the pot.

Decided to call his bluff to see him holding K/10 so all I had to do was fade a k/10 to win the pot.

River came an 8 making the straight.



That doubled me up and put me and villain 8 on almost identical stacks, very next hand played out like this.

I'm now SB and get AKo villain 8 bets 150 so I raise to 250, as I'm putting him on an Ace/facecard or two picture cards but pretty sure he wasn't on a pair as twice previously when he had been holding a pair he had just limped into the pot.
Villian_8 goes all in not sure if he's on tilt or not and a call commits my whole stack.

I decide to call.


So two hands made me a big stack but should I have really got involved in these calls either of which could have ended the tournament for me.

Was it the right call in the second hand based on my reads of the player?
 
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Mon Sep 22, 2014, 11:50 AM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,809
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Hi Webbo62!

In the first hand, it's ok to call preflop with A4, but the flop is a clear fold. We have and OESD (8 outs) and maybe the other 3 aces as outs. This means that our hand is worth 16% or 22% if the aces are clean outs. To call, it's 380 into a pot that will be 1140 or 33.3%. Since the pot equity is higher than my hand equity, this is a fold because I expect to LOSE chips each and every time I would call.

AK hand: With a limp, then an abnormally small button raise (standard is 3BB+1BB for each limper), if I want to 3-bet, I need to make a standard one, which is to 2.5X-3X the previous bet. With multiple opps in the hand, I tend to go for the higher end of this range and will opt to raise to 450.
I do not want to raise smaller than this or I can be giving the opps the correct odds to be in the hand to try to outdraw me. If I give them the right odds and lose, it's my own fault that I lose the hand.

When the opp shoves, whether to call or fold comes down to a read on the opp. If they are a tight player, I'm folding.. if they're a loose player, then I'm calling.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Tue Sep 23, 2014, 03:22 AM
(#3)
Webbo62's Avatar
Since: Jul 2014
Posts: 357
BronzeStar
Ok the first play was down to the fact the SB was super loose and super aggressive and had amassed a big stack with some lucky all in's previously having seen him go all in and win with Q8o. That was the reason I continued to play that hand assuming the ace was probably ahead and I had a OESD. But I take your point the pot odds were against a call, but against a player that player super aggressive like this one he would never have given me the correct odds unless I had already made the hand.

Would it be the right play to fold even if you felt the player was betting and shoving with the losing hand?

So if I understand correctly I should have bet 450 preflop as a 3bet and not a bet of 250 as I made. Ok that makes sense not sure if it would have changed the outcome of the hand but will certainly be doing that in future as I would have expected the limper to get out of the way if I had bet as you say at 3x the raise. where as my bet was low enough for him to call.

Thanks again JWK
 
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Tue Sep 23, 2014, 11:42 AM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,809
(Super-Moderator)
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It doesn't matter how fishy the opp is. When we're the one on a draw, if the math behind the call tells us we'll lose chips by calling... we need to fold.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 

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