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AK got me in trouble

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AK got me in trouble - Mon Sep 22, 2014, 05:56 AM
(#1)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
It is $5.50 Super Stack tournament on FTP with 12min slow blind level and 5000 starting stack.

I thought Player 'MakcuMyc' must be tilted from the last hand as he got value owned, you can see that hand below where he lost a big pot.

Last hand where he lost:

Full Tilt Poker Game #34717736758: Super Stack $1K Guarantee (276206445), Table 15 - NL Hold'em - 60/120 Ante 15 - 15:06:13 IST - 2014/09/22 [05:36:13 ET - 2014/09/22]
Seat 1: _MakcuMyc_27 (5,400)
Seat 2: Philly0220 (5,285)
Seat 3: Udaff76 (11,855)
Seat 4: adikumar2010 (7,234)
Seat 5: djfimas (5,976)
Seat 6: Sakharegion14 (10,787)
Seat 7: Boggdann (12,425)
Seat 8: newada 1 (2,000)
Seat 9: Pmate16 (8,127)
_MakcuMyc_27 antes 15
Philly0220 antes 15
Udaff76 antes 15
adikumar2010 antes 15
djfimas antes 15
Sakharegion14 antes 15
Boggdann antes 15
newada 1 antes 15
Pmate16 antes 15
djfimas posts the small blind of 60
Sakharegion14 posts the big blind of 120
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to adikumar2010 [ ]
Boggdann folds
newada 1 raises to 480
Pmate16 folds
_MakcuMyc_27 raises to 1,200
Philly0220 folds
Udaff76 folds
adikumar2010 folds
djfimas folds
Sakharegion14 folds
newada 1 raises to 1,985, and is all in
_MakcuMyc_27 calls 785
newada 1 shows [ ]
_MakcuMyc_27 shows [ ]
*** FLOP *** [ ] (Total Pot: 4,285, 2 Players, 1 All-In)
*** TURN *** [ ] [] (Total Pot: 4,285, 2 Players, 1 All-In)
*** RIVER *** [ ] [] (Total Pot: 4,285, 2 Players, 1 All-In)
newada 1 shows two pair, Aces and Queens
_MakcuMyc_27 shows two pair, Aces and Nines
newada 1 wins the pot (4,285) with two pair, Aces and Queens
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4,285 | Rake 0
Board: [ ]
Seat 1: _MakcuMyc_27 showed [ ] and lost with two pair, Aces and Nines
Seat 2: Philly0220 folded before the Flop
Seat 3: Udaff76 folded before the Flop
Seat 4: adikumar2010 (button) folded before the Flop
Seat 5: djfimas (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 6: Sakharegion14 (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 7: Boggdann folded before the Flop
Seat 8: newada 1 showed [ ] and won (4,285) with two pair, Aces and Queens
Seat 9: Pmate16 folded before the Flop

================================================== =========================

Now in this hand I was very sure he is raising light and I was ready to call his shove as I knew he is on tilt from last hand. So I was never folding AK against him. But there was a problem when I picked up a 3-bet cold caller. In order to isolate 'Sakharegion14' I re-shoved over the '_MakcuMyc_27' shove.

Did I play the hand correct if not then what is the other way to play this hand. I ripped in 60BB against a fish range but I don't understand how can someone call such a big 5-bet shove with

Full Tilt Poker Game #34717738026: Super Stack $1K Guarantee (276206445), Table 15 - NL Hold'em - 60/120 Ante 15 - 15:06:59 IST - 2014/09/22 [05:36:59 ET - 2014/09/22]
Seat 1: _MakcuMyc_27 (3,400)
Seat 2: Philly0220 (5,270)
Seat 3: Udaff76 (11,840)
Seat 4: adikumar2010 (7,219)
Seat 5: djfimas (5,901)
Seat 6: Sakharegion14 (10,652)
Seat 7: Boggdann (12,410)
Seat 8: newada 1 (4,285)
Seat 9: Pmate16 (8,112)
_MakcuMyc_27 antes 15
Philly0220 antes 15
Udaff76 antes 15
adikumar2010 antes 15
djfimas antes 15
Sakharegion14 antes 15
Boggdann antes 15
newada 1 antes 15
Pmate16 antes 15
Sakharegion14 posts the small blind of 60
Boggdann posts the big blind of 120
The button is in seat #5
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to adikumar2010 [ ]
newada 1 calls 120
Pmate16 folds
_MakcuMyc_27 raises to 300
Philly0220 folds
Udaff76 folds
adikumar2010 has 15 seconds left to act
adikumar2010 has requested TIME
adikumar2010 raises to 840
djfimas folds
Sakharegion14 calls 780
Boggdann has 15 seconds left to act
Boggdann folds
newada 1 calls 720
_MakcuMyc_27 has 15 seconds left to act
_MakcuMyc_27 raises to 3,385, and is all in
adikumar2010 has 15 seconds left to act
adikumar2010 raises to 7,204, and is all in
Sakharegion14 calls 6,364
newada 1 folds
adikumar2010 shows [ ]
Sakharegion14 shows [ ]
_MakcuMyc_27 shows [ ]
*** FLOP *** [ ] (Total Pot: 18,888, 3 Players, 2 All-In)
*** TURN *** [ ] [] (Total Pot: 18,888, 3 Players, 2 All-In)
*** RIVER *** [ ] [] (Total Pot: 18,888, 3 Players, 2 All-In)
adikumar2010 shows a pair of Nines
Sakharegion14 shows two pair, Tens and Nines
Sakharegion14 wins the side pot (7,638) with two pair, Tens and Nines
_MakcuMyc_27 shows a pair of Nines
Sakharegion14 wins the main pot (11,250) with two pair, Tens and Nines
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 18,888 Main pot 11,250. Side pot 7,638. | Rake 0
Board: [9c 5c 4d 3s 9d]
Seat 1: _MakcuMyc_27 showed [ ] and lost with a pair of Nines
Seat 2: Philly0220 folded before the Flop
Seat 3: Udaff76 folded before the Flop
Seat 4: adikumar2010 showed [ ] and lost with a pair of Nines
Seat 5: djfimas (button) folded before the Flop
Seat 6: Sakharegion14 (small blind) showed [ ] and won (18,888) with two pair, Tens and Nines
Seat 7: Boggdann (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 8: newada 1 folded before the Flop
Seat 9: Pmate16 folded before the Flop

STATS :
 
Old
Default
Mon Sep 22, 2014, 02:06 PM
(#2)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
Hi adi,

I think your read is a fairly big leap of faith... meaning I see no good reason to think that the guy losing with 99 to a 16bb stack who woke up with QQ would tilt off because of it. I do think, given the positions, he overplayed his 99 a bit and did set himself up to get the money in bad, but hardly see it as tilt-worthy, so unless he made some chat that indicated tilt, I think it's a dangerous assumption here.

All that being said, I think we have other concerns in this spot. We are not just dealing with the villain in question, our 3-bet got cold called by 2 other players behind us. If your target here was in fact obviously tilting, this is even more concerning as now the other players are far more likely to cold call with premiums to trap a tilter into shoving light. Including the UTG limper, who may have been looking for a limp-reraise on the tilter, but since someone else reraised for him and the tilter can still shove behind, decides to cold call as a trap.

If the target is not tilting, that doesn't mean the news is much better. Our action shows a lot of strength and the guy behind us doesn't care, his cold call range on deeper stacks like this (60bb effective with you) is probably like 99+/AK.

Given you think the OR might be tilting, I would snap AK in vs. his 28bbs and take my chances if we were HU. But with the action behind us I think the risk factor is increased well behind my tastes for a slow structure MTT where I have a decent/playable stack to protect. There's a non-zero chance one of them is playing us, and the risk to our stack isn't half of it, it's all of it vs. the SB.

As to how he can call your 60bb rip with TT... that's easy. He's playing 34/7 and he has a big hand in his mind. I doubt he even considered finding a fold.


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Old
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Mon Sep 22, 2014, 02:17 PM
(#3)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
So what should I have done fold once '_MakcuMyc_27' 4-bet all-in or should I just call his shove which is 55% of my stack. Same thing call/reshove I am pot committed even if I plan to call 4-bet shove.

Only thing is if I fold and someone behind me calls with there AQs AJs KQs, I will beat up myself. It's super awkward spot as I know he is 4-bet shoving garbage and I beat him but to call his 4-bet is same as going all-in for me. If I fold I lose money to that stupid 4-bet steal.

If I shove don't you think people will fold 22-JJ in that spot more often then not?

Am I right that I should just fold coz the 3-bet cold caller will never fold whose range looks like AJ+, KQs, 22+? Which means in short that I am flipping against 3-bet cold caller's range but I was thinking that if I shove I have fold equity and can get headsup with '_MakcuMyc_27'

Last edited by adikumar2010; Mon Sep 22, 2014 at 02:53 PM..
 
Old
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Mon Sep 22, 2014, 03:08 PM
(#4)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by adikumar2010 View Post
So what should I have done fold once '_MakcuMyc_27' 4-bet all-in or should I just call his shove which is 55% of my stack. Same thing call/reshove I am pot committed even if I plan to call 4-bet shove.
If you play the hand you should certainly reshove. I think folding is the superior option in your situation, if that wasn't clear.

Quote:
Only thing is I fold and hope someone behind me calls with there AQs AJs KQs. It's super awkward spot as I know he is 4-bet shoving garbage and I beat him but to call his 4-bet is same as going all-in for me. If I fold I lose money to that stupid 4-bet steal.
1) You do not know he his shoving garbage. You are making an assumption he is tilting, which imo is not founded on reasonable evidence. Maybe he's on tilt or is just a clown, but his range in fact could be much tighter than you give credit for here.

2) We have 2 players behind us to contend with as well, not just him, and I think you're not giving their ranges enough credit either. The irony here is that if he were obviously tilting, like if he were going off in chat while blasting away, that would make it even more likely we're in trouble behind us... if I were the big stack I would flat your 3B with AA all day long to allow the obvious tilter to do his thing, and maybe trap you into making a big mistake.

Quote:
If I shove don't you think people will fold 22-JJ in that spot more often then not?
Depends on who the people are. A 34/7 guy who has already cold called a 3b, no, not so much.

Quote:
Am I right that I should just fold coz the 3-bet cold caller will never fold whose range looks like AJ+, KQs, 22+? Which means in short that I am flipping against 3-bet cold caller's range but I was thinking that if I shove I am fold equity and can get headsup with '_MakcuMyc_27'
You may have this a little backwards. We have 2 cold callers, not 1, and if I thought either/both of them are going to cold call then monkey it off with all AJ and KQ combos here, I wouldn't be as reticent to take this spot. I think we are underestimating everyone's ranges though.


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Old
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Mon Sep 22, 2014, 03:15 PM
(#5)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
FTR, reshoving isn't horrible or anything, there are just a lot of variables here that make it a very high-variance play. If you are looking to greatly increase your variance to build a huge pile quickly or be out of this thing, then taking a spot like this will do that nicely. When we can pass the spot and continue on with a 53bb stack in a slow structure event, it's not necessary to take this spot, we will probably be able to find better/more well defined spots to play for huge pots as well as fight to chip up with small/medium pots taking much less variance on board in the process.


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