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Another AK hand

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Another AK hand - Mon Dec 30, 2002, 05:04 PM
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Flat Call - Mon Dec 30, 2002, 05:15 PM
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I'd tend to flat call with A K - until it's seriously short-handed or until I'm on the Button with all folds to me.

- otherwise, it's just a decent drawing hand.

With a Q55 flop, I'm not thrilled. MIGHT call a possible 300 unit bet, probably not - and I'm gone with anything bigger.

I took my cion flip - missed it: "fit or fold" is still a powerful axiom!
 
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Mon Dec 30, 2002, 05:23 PM
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Mon Dec 30, 2002, 05:43 PM
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easy all in, your reraise of 1800 more might win you the pot right there...you want to see the whole board with AK, if you call and there is a bet in front of you on the flop, folding would be a weak way to play it...you might as well as have folded it preflop if you are going to play it like that. you missed your coinflip, that's it.
 
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Mon Dec 30, 2002, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreams32097
easy all in, your reraise of 1800 more might win you the pot right there...you want to see the whole board with AK, if you call and there is a bet in front of you on the flop, folding would be a weak way to play it...you might as well as have folded it preflop if you are going to play it like that. you missed your coinflip, that's it.
What he said.
By getting allin you might ... coinflip anyway ....
What he said :lol:
Right play

Cheers :wink:
 
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Mon Dec 30, 2002, 08:20 PM
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Allin for reasons stated above.
 
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Tue Dec 31, 2002, 08:55 AM
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Aaron,

Keeping the raiser's aggressive tendencies in mind, without knowing how the caller plays(though probably weakly,given the call here), I'd move in practically every time. A flat call by you would be, IMO, poor play- the hand you're most likely to make with A-K will be a one-pair hand, and I'd much prefer to get this heads-up and blow the caller off the hand here. Of course, one weak play often leads to another, so the caller may call the second raise as well, but there's nothing to be done about that.

In cases when you flat call pre-flop, what do you on the board of
Q-5-5, and are bet into by the aggressive player? You don't have any idea where you are in the hand, and it's worse still if the pre-flop limper has hung about and calls the flop bet. There, I'm through with my lovely A-K, which has turned to ashes before my very eyes, so prefer not to get into this spot at all.

Alan
 
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Tue Dec 31, 2002, 08:56 AM
(#8)
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Aaron,

Keeping the raiser's aggressive tendencies in mind, without knowing how the caller plays(though probably weakly,given the call here), I'd move in practically every time. A flat call by you would be, IMO, poor play- the hand you're most likely to make with A-K will be a one-pair hand, and I'd much prefer to get this heads-up and blow the caller off the hand here. Of course, one weak play often leads to another, so the caller may call the second raise as well, but there's nothing to be done about that.

In cases when you flat call pre-flop, what do you on the board of
Q-5-5, and are bet into by the aggressive player? You don't have any idea where you are in the hand, and it's worse still if the pre-flop limper has hung about and calls the flop bet. There, I'm through with my lovely A-K, which has turned to ashes before my very eyes, so prefer not to get into this spot at all.

Alan
 
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Re: Another AK hand - Tue Dec 31, 2002, 10:21 AM
(#9)
Deleted user
Quote:
Originally Posted by thehazyone
Midstages of 1000 player freeroll at unnamed site. After having AA cracked by TT in third hand of tourney and being down to 60 in chips I have built back up to 2100 (1500 starting).
Bad beat story and tooting own horn. Nice start

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I get AK suited one before the cutoff. UTG, aggressive player who will raise with any PP, raises 300 (blinds 50-100), one caller after him.

I went all in, thinking in this type of tourney I need to build a stack and play some of these coin flips aggressively
How did you know it was a coinflip? Could they not have had a worse ace?

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I know there has been some discussion on flat calling here and pushing in on certain types of flops, but with the other caller here, I didn't think that was the optimal play.
Your money is not deep enough to call.

Your position is not good enough, and your hand is too good, to call and bet all-in on flop regardless, (as a kind of bluff).


Quote:
There was 750 in the pot at the time, and I had shown down in my previous 4 hands where I went from 60 to 2100, quad 6's, AK, KK and AA so I thought best case they all fold, worst case, I face one opponent with an underpair.
In my opinion, best case scenario is you get 1 caller with a worse ace. I mean, if they raise and call your all-in with small pp then they also raise and call your all-in with worse aces, right?

Heck, if we are ever in a situation where the worse case scenario is that we have 2 overcards to a pp if we happen to be called, then re-raise all-in every time.

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Do you think pushing all in here was the correct call?
Yes.

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A smaller raise (which would have committed me to the pot anyway, especially considering the 99 reraised all in after my all in to isolate me)?
Achieves nothing beneficial as far as I can see.

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A flat call? If you flat call what do you do on the following board? Q55
Either fold when it is inevitably bet to you, or go all-in when it is bet to you, and hope they were bluffing with the worse ace. Neither a pleasent choice to make.


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I think I made the right decision here, but interested to see if anyone has other thoughts on this. Noodles? Apryll? Wst? Freddie?
Freddie? You want freddie's advice? Really?

Only joking Freddie
 
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Tue Dec 31, 2002, 11:54 AM
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Tue Dec 31, 2002, 08:36 PM
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Deleted user
Once there's a raise, you should only raise all-in or fold.
Folding AK is a mistake most times, but it could be right if you didn't have such a read on the maniac. Also, the size of the raise before you was either a bad play(with a hand such as 99), or a descent one with big Ace. A larger raise and consider folding, but here you've got to go all-in.
I agree, after just calling play on the flop is a nightmare unless you flop an Ace or King. Even then you've let others see the flop rather cheap, and that 99 or the other guy could hit a set or 2-pair and burn your big pair anyway. I didn't even mention the draws that could get a lucky board.

Limping with AK sometimes a good play, but it is only possible with no raises before you. Maybe if you had a lot more chips you could just call and hope to hit the Ace or King else fold.
 
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Wed Jan 01, 2003, 10:59 AM
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This is an article from noodles. I think this says it all:

www.cardplayer.com/?sec=afeature&art_id=12995


Randy/Randall
 
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Wed Jan 01, 2003, 12:02 PM
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Deleted user
Heh. Randy, I don't think I can take credit. I think what you meant to say was, 'here is an article Noodles sent me'. But then, maybe I really am Ciaffone lol

And it doesn't say it all, but it's very good. Excellent in fact.

I think the main thing it leaves unclear, but I may be remembering wrong, is that this advice applies when there is no ante. With an ante, it is usually better to raise.
 
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Wed Jan 01, 2003, 12:03 PM
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Wed Jan 01, 2003, 12:26 PM
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Hazy said:
Quote:
I knew it! Noodles is really Ciaffone. Thanks for clearing that up Randall.
Damn, I had money on Jack-the-Ripper re-incarnated and Mary Poppins.....****ing tout services....
 
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Wed Jan 01, 2003, 01:41 PM
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Deleted user
It's truly amazing how everything in life can exposed as a fake, an
utter fraud, if one puts one's mind to it.

From time to time, I've worked with Bob Ciaffone, and now I join this site, only to find out he's Noodles!! Is there nothing sacred????

:wink:

Alan
 

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